Statistics based on Research from Sandra L. Brown

Survivor Profile

© 2014 The Institute for Relational Harm Reduction (from Sandra L. Brown’s training)

  • All survivors will have experienced some trauma symptoms during or after the pathological love relationship (PLR/Pathological Love Relationship = her terms for having a narcissistic abuse partner)
  • 37% have high ACE scores related to adverse childhoods; their trauma usually falls between moderate PTSD-c-PTSD ++ and higher. These survivors may have the history most associated with codependency. (I have not seen PTSD with the majority of my survivors, except when they meet Criteria A, in the DSM 5, measured with testing, and this is generally when they are with an Anti-Social PD, not a NPD ).
  • 63% have low ACE scores and many did not have adverse childhoods. Their trauma was created in the pathological love relationship and usually falls between mild/moderate PTSD. These survivors have the history most associated with super traits of personality (super traits explained in her training).
  • All survivors have atypical trauma related to the effect of cognitive dissonance on their trauma. (This is what I am seeing).

Most of the time I am working with the 37% and I would say this is 99% of my survivor population. My thoughts are that if I were going to conduct research, I would want to strictly focus on survivors of Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I think this will show some interesting nuances. Sandra L. Brown has written a number of books, that you can find on the internet. If you are a therapist reading this, her workshop is on PESI. This study is referenced on my Resource page above. Please note, this study focused solely on women who were survivors.

Somebody that I Used to Know – Gotye

Above is the video of this song, below are my translations as to what I believe the words mean when I look at them in the context of a narcissist. Not sure if this is what he was thinking, but I suspect it could be. I feel like this song is his way of telling us how he redirected himself in the process of moving forward after a narcissist. Take a look and see:

Now and then I think of when we were together,

Like when you said you felt so happy you could die,

Told myself that you were right for me, (Love Bombing)

But felt so lonely in your company, (Trauma Bond)

But that was love and it’s an ache I still remember.

You can get addicted to a certain kind of sadness,

Like resignation to the end, (Trauma  Bond)

Always the end,

So when we found that we could not make sense,

Well you said that we would still be friends,

But I’ll admit that I was glad that it was over. (Self-Realization – Healthy Detachment)

But you didn’t have to cut me off, (Discard)

Make out like it never happened,

And that now we’re nothing,

And I don’t even need your love, (Trauma Bond)

But you treat me like a stranger,

And that feels so rough,

No you didn’t have to stoop so low,

Have your friends collect your records, (Discard)

And then change your number, (Discard)

I guess that I don’t need that though,

Now you’re just somebody that I used to know, (Healthy detaching process)

Now and then I think of all the times you screwed me over

But had me believing it was always something that I’d done (Gaslighting)

And I don’t wanna live that way

Reading into every word you say (Romantic Delusion)

You said that you could let it go

And I wouldn’t catch you hung up on somebody that you used to know…

The Vulnerable Narcissistic Wife – Darren F. Magee

Darren is a psychotherapist in Belfast, Ireland and has a Youtube channel. I have enjoyed learning from him in relation to men who are survivors of narcissists. If you are a male reading this, I would also look up Borderline Personality Disorder. I have found that some of the male’s I have been working with are actually dealing with this type of personality disorder, where narcissism is a symptom but better served under this umbrella.

Crying Doesn’t Fix the Pain – But it Helps in the Healing Process

“All happy families are alike; each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way.” Leo Tolstoy – Anna Karenina

As a Child of a Narcissist, when you cry it doesn’t fix the pain – they don’t get better. You are still trapped in a home with two parents who are emotionally immature, damaged, wounded and are so detached from their own pain and have no self-awareness. Without self-awareness, from a parent, you are stuck with them. As Is. I cried growing up, all the time. I cried because I felt unloved, unwanted, that no one would listen to me. I felt like a robot living my mom’s life, behaving like my dad wanted. I didn’t know who I was. After I met the guy who would later become my husband and faced his abuse and detachment, I began to cut. This was before it was a “trend” something you read about on social media. I didn’t even know this was a “thing.” I just scratched and scratched until blood came out. I wore long sleeves so no one would see what I was doing. Meanwhile, if I cried, I would hear “Why are you crying? You have no reason to cry” from my mom. Or my dad, when punishing us would say “If you cry, I will whip you more. Toughen up.” They saw my arms and said, “What did you do to yourself?” I can’t recall the excuse I made up. Maybe they said I was crazy.

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Coercive Control by a Parent in the Courtroom

This is an issue that is often unrecognized in courtrooms due to a lack of training and knowledge of this topic. This is a good video and a great discussion between three professional women who highlight different cases they are aware of.

As an ex-CPS worker I can say that emotional abuse, manipulation, this is very difficult to see – which they talk about above. This is rarely a reason to remove a child.

What I will also add is that men can sometimes be a victim of coercive control as well. I have listened to many stories of how women and turned a situation around to their advantage and the man walks away penniless or alienated from his children.

Dr. Christine Cocchiola. Take a look at her website to learn more about her training/coaching for professionals and clients.

If you get a chance and can find the documentary Divorce Corp. It is very telling to hear about how finances play a role in lengthening this process – when people have it and even when they don’t.

Narcissists at the Movies

Movies are my favorite tool for helping a client to understand what I am talking about. All of the films below show a relationship with a NPD, in different ways. Some of the films below are shown in the Marquee above.

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When are they NOT a Narcissist?

There are so many articles about Narcissism on the internet. It is easy to lump someone into a category when “narcissistic traits” may seem to be prevalent in many other diagnoses. This is the reason why it is inappropriate to diagnose someone who is not in the room. Often times, I will hear people talking about their partner and I realize they may have TBI or PTSD. They may also have Depression or some other mental health condition. Addicts DO seem to be narcissistic but this is because they are putting the addiction before the family, job or partner. Below are some things to be aware of. No one should diagnose anyone unless they are a psychological professional and they are in the room with this person. Even then, we don’t necessarily tell the person, unless we are going to do treatment on them or they seem open to listening.

  1. Narcissistic traits vs. personality disorder – As mentioned above, the traits can be seen in a myriad of diagnoses and so it might not be the personality disorder. We are all egotistical and so there are times when we can seem like narcissists to others.
  2. Another personality disorder. In my practicum, I worked with a woman who had Histrionic Personality Disorder. Now, I can recall her narcissistic traits, but it was way more drama. The men who have begun to see me for a Narcissistic partner, generally seem to be Borderline. Anti-Social Personality Disorder is really what is going on in the movie “Gaslight.”
  3.  I have had people tell me that a mentally ill person was a “narcissist” or that the addict was a “narcissist,” for example. Those traits will surface from these types of other diagnoses. Which comes first though? What will they be like on medication or clean and sober? This is something that we can’t answer until it happens. I try to empathize with the mentally ill person – who is not in treatment – when explaining to my clients or to people in general. With an addict, I will say “Oh, they are an addict. And the fix is their priority, not you or anyone else, which makes them seem like a narcissist.” Mentally ill people often feel bad about the strain caused on their families by their illness.
  4. Is the man/woman angry due to undisclosed sexual abuse or because of a traumatic brain injury or PTSD? I try to dig deep when I hear a man come into my office who says he was told he was a narcissist. Women aren’t generally told this for some reason. If we find out what is really going on, then we can treat the problem and find a solution. If a man is coming into my office and addressing his own narcissism by taking responsibility for this, that is usually a good sign. I would like to say that most likely they are not as the narcissist does not take responsibility. It is always everyone else’s fault.
  5. Women will often ask “Am I a Narcissist,” thinking it is genetic or maybe it wasn’t my mom or maybe it wasn’t my husband/boyfriend, maybe it was me. There is a study that I have read but I am not convinced yet, I have seen it re-enacted but not inherited.
  6. There are walls put up by the person with PTSD. I specialize in this, and I prepare for the defensiveness when they have it (not always), sometimes they can be quite angry. I never take it personally; they aren’t angry at me or at us as psychotherapists. Their behaviors sometimes can be narcissistic because they are protecting themselves from assumed tragedy, crisis, pending danger. They are angry at all men or all women. They are angry at the perpetrator and their ego shows us a very cocky, know it all, in charge, protector – or a very strong person who is trying to be in control of the world around them. They know this. The narcissist is not aware that they are doing these behaviors, some are conscious though and this is a whole other level.

The narcissist is not aware of their behaviors and how it impacts others. The parent is not concerned about how their children will turn out as adults and how it correlates to the way they raised them. They will talk about their children’s outcomes and will approve or disapprove but do not correlate with themselves and their spouse. They are “bad children”, “they became drug addicts,” “they are a horrible parent,” “they live in the basement because they can’t make it on their own.” I have heard a parent say, “I don’t want them to leave, because I don’t want to be alone.” That is, at least, some acknowledgement of responsibility.

In conclusion, don’t assume the person is a narcissist. If the articles you are reading online, make sense, talk to a therapist to discuss this further. The most important thing is not their diagnosis but how you are handling this relationship, yourself, and what steps should you take to heal and move on in your life. Take a look at my workshop on the “Survivors” page above, which can be found on Udemy.

What is a Narcissist?

a woman kissing a mask instead of the man who has turned

What does a narcissist look like? According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual 5 – 0-6% of the population has an actual diagnosis of Narcissistic Personality Disorder and of this population 75% are male. I am going to tell you the traits of a narcissistic person, not the diagnostic criteria. I don’t want you to get caught up in what the diagnosis is because it doesn’t matter. If you are a therapist reading this, than you will know where to look to find this answer but what really matters is the personality type, not the diagnosis. This is because you are not working with the narcissist but with the survivor. If you are the survivor, you need to focus on YOUR LIFE right now.

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